ForumsSuggestionTalent Tree Concept
Talent Tree Concept
04/06/11 8:07 pm
The idea of "talents", or special traits players can imbue themselves with to better increase their functionality in Battle, along with adding utility, has always been a concept I'd love to see introduced into Coven Wars. Each person could develop their own "build" (combination of talents) to match the play style (along with stats and equipment) they wish to enjoy.

Basic Information
- (Assumed) Level 100 Cap
- Every 6 Levels gained Awards 1 Talent Point (16 Talent Points for 1-99, Bonus Talent Point Awarded at level 100: Total 17 Talent Points)
- Changing Talents Costs 1000 Souls, $50,000 Money and 300 Turns.
- "Heroic Quests"; Extremely Difficult and Long Quest Chains Award an Additional 3 more Talent Points (but no greater than 3).



Example
WARNING: The following is a concept and suggestion and is by NO way a final approved product, or yet to be implemented. This suggestion stands alone as a suggestion and is not representative of Scot's intent for this game.




Talent Trees*
* Being just an example, these are subject to change if they ever were to be implemented at all. In addition, further talents would be added to, ending in a tree with 13 (mandatory) talents to be taken (to reach the 14th and final talent in the tree).



= Combat =
-- Tier One --
- 0/3 Surgical Precision: Increases your chance to critically strike for double your regular damage by 2/4/6% with melee attacks. You also gain a 1/2/3% additional chance to hit.

- 0/3 Evasion: Increases your chance to avoid attacks by 2/4/6% and reduces your damage taken by 2/4/6%.

-- Tier Two --
REQUIRES: 3 Talent Points in Combat
- 0/2 Frenzy: Successful critical strikes Frenzy you, increasing your total Agility by 7/15% for 7 turns.

- 0/2 Defiance: When your health reaches 10/20%, the chance for you to avoid attacks is increased 2.5/5% for 6 turns. This effect can only occur once per battle.

- 0/1 Improved Devastate: Reduces the cost of your Devastate spell by 25 Turns, and the Blood gained by 25%. In addition, you have a 10% chance when you reduce your opponent's Health to 10% or lower in Battle to instantly Devastate them (ignoring all damage absorption).

-- Tier Three --
REQUIRES: 6 Talent Points in Combat
- 0/2 Invigoration: You regenerate 1/2% of your total Health and Endurance every 10 turns. In addition, whenever you critically strike with a melee attack, you instantly recover 1/2% of your total Health.

- 0/1 Vigor: Increases your melee critical strike chance by 3%. Total Strength and Agility increased by 5%. All damage done increased by 5%. (REQUIRES: 2/2 Invigoration)

- 0/2 Eye for an Eye: When you are critically struck by any hostile ability, you instantly counter attack the target for 15/30% of the damage done to you. In addition, your total Endurance is increased by 2.5/5%.


= Subtlety =
-- Tier One --
- 0/3 Weaken: Increases the rate at which you reduce your opponent's Endurance by 5/10/15%, and damage done to you reduced by 2/4/6%.

- 0/3 Recuperation: Increases your chance to avoid attacks by 1/2/3% and when you nullify an attack, you regenerate .5/1/1.5% of your total Health, also restoring 1/2/3% of your total Endurance.

-- Tier Two --
REQUIRES: 3 Talent Points in Subtlety
- 0/2 Pinpoint Weakness: Every 24/12 turns you expose the weak point of your target, causing your next attack to be critical and unavoidable.

- 0/2 Vanish: You have a 10/20% chance when reduced to 5% total Health to instantly Vanish, fleeing the battle. You do not lose Money nor Win or Loss rating, however, your opponent gains the Blood, Money, and Win as if you had been killed. This effect triggers the Battle Limiter and cannot occur more than twice in a row.

- 0/1 Improved Pain: Whenever you cast Pain on an enemy prior to Battle, all damage done by you to the target is increased 10% for 15 turns. In addition, you have a 15% chance to cripple an enemy in Battle with pain whenever they would have avoided your attack, instead causing it to land without failure.

-- Tier Three --
REQUIRES: 6 Talent Points in Subtlety
- 0/2 Prey on the Weak: You deal 7/15% more damage to targets at or below 10/20% Health, and also gain 5/10% chance to critically strike those targets.

- 0/1 Stealth: When a Battle begins, you have a 15% reduced chance to be struck by melee attacks for 10 turns. In addition, if you are the first to strike in Battle, you stun your opponent for 3 turns, preventing any and all action on their part.

- 0/2 Insight: Increases your awareness, increasing your chance to dodge hostile attacks by 1/2%, and grants a 2.5/5% chance to dismantle your enemy, removing their weapons and armor for 1/2 turns. This effect cannot occur more than 1 time every 60/30 turns.


= Potency =
-- Tier One --
- 0/3 Agony: Your attacks have a 5/10/15% chance to afflict the target for 3/6/9% damage of that strike over the next three turns.

- 0/3 Siphon Power: Whenever you attack successfully, you reduce the victim's damage and healing done by 3/6/9%, and increases your damage done by 3/6/9%. This effect is removed and reset if any of your attacks fail.

-- Tier Two --
REQUIRES: 3 Talent Points in Potency
- 0/2 Spellsurge: Successful attacks have a 2/4% chance to instantly cast a random damaging spell (dealing up to 3/6% of their maximum health in damage) on your enemy, or a beneficial healing spell on you (healing up to 3/6% of your maximum health.) This effect is limited to a maximum of 3 occurrences per Battle.

- 0/2 Arcane Focus: Increases your chance to critically strike for double damage with all attacks by 3/6%, and the damage of all magical attacks in Battle you deal by 7/15%.

- 0/1 Improved Spells: Reduces the cost of all Spells you have access to by 30%. In addition, Pain spells against you are 15% less effective, and your Heal spell when cast on others is increased by 30%, 15% on yourself.

-- Tier Three --
REQUIRES: 6 Talent Points in Potency
- 0/3 Magister: Increases your chance for Spellsurge to occur by 1/2/3%, the damage done by your Agony by 1/2/3%, the damage and healing reduced by Siphon Power by 1/2/3% and increases all magical damage done by 2/4/6%.

- 0/1 Eternal Power: Increases your total Agility, Strength and Endurance by 7%. This talent also grants a 15% chance upon death to instantly revive yourself, free of cost, after a Battle ends. This effect triggers the Battle Limiter and cannot occur more than once every 5 Battles.

- 0/2 Mana Tap: Whenever your Health is reduced by 30/15%, you instantly increase all magical damage and healing done by 2.5/5% and your chance to critically strike by 2/4%, stacking twice, lasting 5/10 turns.




So yeah... Comments, questions, suggestions? If you see any errors, do tell me. :P

Change List
- Update 1:
-- Spaced the talents out to make them easier to read, also bolded the title for each individual Talent Tree.

- Update 2:
-- Arcane Focus increased from 2/4% to 3/6% critical strike chance, and bonus Magic damage from 5/10% to 7/15%. Also now specifically states it affects all abilities.

-- Surgical Precision now also increases your chance to hit the target by 1/2/3%.

-- *Changed* New: 0/3 Siphon Power: Whenever you attack successfully, you reduce the victim's damage and healing done by 1/2/3%, and increases your damage done by 1/2/3%. This effect is removed and reset if any of your attacks fail. Stacks 3 times.

-Update 3:
-- New Talents Added!
04/06/11 8:16 pm
interesting
04/06/11 8:18 pm
Love, love LOVE this idea. Along with the Souls Idea going, and the Coven Bonuses, this would make a prefect fit. If all three get placed in, Coven Wars will be a whole new game, more to do, and much more customization and expansion. If any of the three get placed in, this would probably top my favorite so far.

The ideas are solid, and can be tweaked a bit. I see minor flaws, but nothing that clearly would be fixed upon seeing it placed in the game.

Dextra approves this message! hai
04/06/11 8:21 pm

Dextra Devereux (4) said
Love, love LOVE this idea. Along with the Souls Idea going, and the Coven Bonuses, this would make a prefect fit. If all three get placed in, Coven Wars will be a whole new game, more to do, and much more customization and expansion. If any of the three get placed in, this would probably top my favorite so far.

The ideas are solid, and can be tweaked a bit. I see minor flaws, but nothing that clearly would be fixed upon seeing it placed in the game.

Dextra approves this message! hai



I absolutely concur with Dextra :)
04/06/11 8:38 pm
I do like the idea of this. It could be very interesting. I see some talents that might need to be reworked due to their complexity and how the current systems work but for the most part it's doable.
04/06/11 8:45 pm
Adding to ideas as I do not want to edit my post:

Quests
Have 1-3 quests that take 30-60 days to complete each. Upon completing them, we would be rewarded an extra 1point. This would increase us over the maximum, but not enough to give any one player such an advantage over others. Having 3 quests like this would give us 3 more points. Enough to level us up a tier, and get us branched off a bit more.

Change of talents
To change your talent build, you would need a large sum of money, and most likely a good number of souls. (1-5k currently would seem fair) This would give you your points back and wipe you of your talents to learn all over. A member would be allowed to do this, and if they didn't like their next pick, there would be a barrier stopping them from changing the build again. Probably a 15 day barrier. This stops you from changing so often once souls and money are acquired more easily.

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This goes without saying, or else it loses all value, but point would not be able to be bought from premium packs, nor could they be sold between players. You would also be able to hold all points if you wanted to not customize and utilize this right away. So basically you could reach level 100 and still be holding 16 (19 with quests done) points.
04/06/11 9:26 pm
I love this :)
07/22/11 10:27 am
Changing talents should cost more and more each time you do it, starting a a reasonably low cost, that allows you to do it 1 at a time. Of course you would not be able to remove a talent that is a prerequisite to a talent you have acquired or below the minimum requirement.
07/22/11 12:22 pm
I approve of this. Sounds like a good way to mix up battle abilities. And I like that it's not premium based. :)
07/22/11 12:27 pm
I would like to see this happen.
07/22/11 12:36 pm
As would I, I'm glad people brought it back up. :P
07/22/11 2:41 pm
I like the idea, it will give CW more of an edge with a little more for us players to work for.
07/22/11 3:50 pm
I like this idea a lot.
I'd just add ... don't make talents have a direct effect on stats. Eternal power may not be the best choice for an average player, but for a junker it's far more (too ?) powerful.

Otherwise it's great. :)
07/22/11 3:55 pm
Part of the plan at level 100 is to even the playing field; Premium users will have an advantage but absolutely not have supremacy. If you have Premium, you're ahead of the ball at 100, if you don't, you're behind, but you can still participate.

This suggestion was relative to the "Stat Cap" of level 100, a concept where players could only have up to (I think 1000) of any stat at level 100; any stats over it, once you got to 100, would be converted into Turns (to be used on Crafting), and Crafting itself would provide gear and armor with added Stats.
07/22/11 6:18 pm

Argent Fatalis (50) said
Part of the plan at level 100 is to even the playing field; Premium users will have an advantage but absolutely not have supremacy. If you have Premium, you're ahead of the ball at 100, if you don't, you're behind, but you can still participate.

This suggestion was relative to the "Stat Cap" of level 100, a concept where players could only have up to (I think 1000) of any stat at level 100; any stats over it, once you got to 100, would be converted into Turns (to be used on Crafting), and Crafting itself would provide gear and armor with added Stats.




I like the idea of having this talent tree stuff sort of sounds good. But You wanted the stats to be capped too? Might as well call the game COVEN CHAT CAP WARS :D
07/22/11 6:25 pm

RZT-Predator (2633) said



I like the idea of having this talent tree stuff sort of sounds good. But You wanted the stats to be capped too? Might as well call the game COVEN CHAT CAP WARS :D



Premium is radically overpowered, people shouldn't need to pay, to play, they should pay because they want to keep playing by funding Scot and the game.

Anyone Premium would receive extensive benefits because of such a recalculation at 100 because it would give you an enormous advantage with Crafting (by giving you turns). :P

Balance is critical to game longevity, and right now, we lack it.


Edited at 07/22 18:25:44
07/22/11 6:29 pm

Argent Fatalis (50) said


Premium is radically overpowered, people shouldn't need to pay, to play, they should pay because they want to keep playing by funding Scot and the game.

Anyone Premium would receive extensive benefits because of such a recalculation at 100 because it would give you an enormous advantage with Crafting (by giving you turns). :P

Balance is critical to game longevity, and right now, we lack it.


Edited at 07/22 18:25:44



I agree with you it is overpowering but capping everything is not the way.. Maybe changing the packages would be better?..
07/22/11 6:43 pm

RZT-Predator (2633) said


I agree with you it is overpowering but capping everything is not the way.. Maybe changing the packages would be better?..



This is a legitimate concept, however, there is one significant flaw; it grandfathers all the old Premium users and packages. This creates an even larger issue, as newer level 100s wouldn't even remotely be able to compete in the slightest versus others who have much better Premium stocks from before the conversion.

A cap would limit the threshold (for Premium users like yourself, this is a non issue, as you'd have 1,000 in all Stats and tens of thousands of turns left over to spend on Crafting and gain Tier equipment well beyond anyone else) without causing much issue.

Continued, sufficient Premium purchase would nullify talents all together; what would it matter that your opponent has a better build than you when you can still kill them in two hits?
07/22/11 6:56 pm
I see what your saying... and its good ideas and great about the talent tree.. But im going to have to disagree on the limt stats cap. I cant see the site being as funded well as it is now if that was to happen.
07/22/11 7:11 pm

RZT-Predator (2633) said
I see what your saying... and its good ideas and great about the talent tree.. But im going to have to disagree on the limt stats cap. I cant see the site being as funded well as it is now if that was to happen.



If individuals are investing in the game solely to be a "power player" and not to see the game develop and evolve with particular benefits for their donations, I'm not quite sure how to respond to that beyond the statement I am disappointed.

Ultimately, as I have stated before, the purpose of talents is nullified if Premium users have the stats they do right now, and at worst, they are not nullified, but reduced to another cudgel for imbalance.
07/22/11 7:36 pm

Argent Fatalis (50) said


If individuals are investing in the game solely to be a "power player" and not to see the game develop and evolve with particular benefits for their donations, I'm not quite sure how to respond to that beyond the statement I am disappointed.

Ultimately, as I have stated before, the purpose of talents is nullified if Premium users have the stats they do right now, and at worst, they are not nullified, but reduced to another cudgel for imbalance.



If individuals are investing in the game solely to be a power player....... Argent no offense but what planet are you living in on??? The majority of people including me who buy premium do it for the main fact in it does power us up.. Its fact that that we like the premium for what it gives. Now 9/10 people would say the same thing.. yes its good that it funds the site and helps along the way but if it was a vote the only people that would say they only bought premium to fund the site are the do gooders trying to gain brownie points i apologise for those who do generally purchase to help the site and sorry for being blunt but thats how it is. So sorry for your disapointment. :(


Edited at 07/22 19:37:13


Edited at 07/22 19:38:41


Edited at 07/22 19:39:50
07/22/11 8:07 pm

RZT-Predator (2633) said


If individuals are investing in the game solely to be a power player....... Argent no offense but what planet are you living in on??? The majority of people including me who buy premium do it for the main fact in it does power us up.. Its fact that that we like the premium for what it gives. Now 9/10 people would say the same thing.. yes its good that it funds the site and helps along the way but if it was a vote the only people that would say they only bought premium to fund the site are the do gooders trying to gain brownie points i apologise for those who do generally purchase to help the site and sorry for being blunt but thats how it is. So sorry for your disapointment. :(


Edited at 07/22 19:37:13


Edited at 07/22 19:38:41


Edited at 07/22 19:39:50



Your donations to Coven Wars is absolutely rewarded, and rightly so, but solely for the fact of becoming "the best"? I disagree entirely, players should want to see the game grow and prosper, and their investment grow in that more updates are added, more content is created, and new members join. But to only purchase Premium to overpower anyone and everything in game? I can not say I am proud of that ideal.

The "gooders", as you called them, are not looking for "brownie points", they are looking for an investment and an evolution of the game they just spent money on.

All in all, all Premium members are valued for their contributions, but as an individual (aka, not speaking as Staff) I still find it disappointing.
07/22/11 8:10 pm
lol ok ;)
07/23/11 1:22 am
Oh yeah; almost forget about this. I'll try to finish my example tomorrow morning and show it to you. :P
07/23/11 2:28 am
I like the talent tree idea :)
07/23/11 7:40 am
Could the talent system be expanded to cover areas other than battle, such as:
~ Hunting (chance of succes, money/blood gain, maybe small % of getting an additional soul ?).
~ Crafting (increased chance of gaining a level/successfully crafting, maybe craft slightly better equipment ?).
~ Money management (increased interest, reduced prices, better gains from battle/workplace).
~ timers (reduce the 2 hour interval for your attacks, increase your own safety period)
~ alignement (increased gains/chance of effect/power of effect).

Having this level of choice would enable a real differentiation in character development. :)
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